Show Notes

Sales are a part of your everyday life. They’re not just for the big deals, they happen in little moments like when you help someone find their perfect shirt or give advice on what movie to watch this weekend – that’s sales! Join me with my friend Katie Nelson as we tackle one thing most people would much rather avoid: selling themselves and those around them without being pushy or overbearing (you’ll be surprised how easy it can sound).

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Jennifer: Hey there, welcome back to marketing matchmaker, so this is the month of November. Well, not technically as I’m recording this, but when it comes out, it will be the month of November and the month of November is all about giving back to my audience, which means bringing on people that have maybe nothing to do with marketing, but a lot to do with growing your business. And doing that effectively, and well. So definitely stay tuned for the other episodes because some of them will have things to do with marketing, a little bit, and some of them will have nothing to do. Today, I am super excited to have my friend Katie on. Today, we are actually going to dive into sales, which is completely in line with marketing and different from marketing. So, I’m going to do a quick introduction to you for to all of you from Katie. So, Katie Nelson is a serial entrepreneur, and speaker who comes at business with a revenue first mindset. Fond of saying “cashflow is oxygen,” she provides her clients with clear understanding that as businesses, if you’re not selling, you are failing. CEO of Sales UpRising, a business coaching firm serving clients nationwide, specializing in providing mindset sales and marketing tools for business owners who struggle to take home a six figure paycheck. She has built her firm around the strategic that 90% of small business owners never reach the monetary goals they dream of when they start their business. So, that’s all a lot well and good, but let me tell you a little bit about Katie. She is amazing at sales and we share girl crush, which is so fun, because she is actually the counterpart to my marketing. I bring you the leads. Katie teaches you how to close them. Welcome to the show, Katie, I’m super excited to have you.

Katie: I’m super excited to be here. Jennifer, thank you so much for that amazing introduction, and for confirming my girl crush. (both laugh) So ridiculous… so just to let you guys know, Jennifer and I had the opportunity to spend an amazing weekend together at a CEO retreat, where our crushes, I believe, were mutually solidified. That’s how that happened.

Jennifer: Absolutely, absolutely it was so fun. And I got to see you speak on the stage, all about sales, which I was just in the audience, “preach my friend.” So let’s dive into sales, and kind of like your vantage point of- we all know sales is important, because if you’re not selling, you are not having a business, you have a really expensive hobby. So, from your vantage point, what do people need in order to sell like what what kind of things do they have to have ready?

Katie: So, nothing out of context, right? So, selling for me is extremely contextual. If you’re in the beginning of your business, you don’t need anything except for your offer, and like, your two feet to go talk to some people and like that’s that. Part of the reason why you love me is because I will tell people what marketing can and can’t do for you, right?

Jennifer: Absolutely.

Katie: Until you understand 100% who your target market is, and who you’re selling to, and how they like to be talked to- what is it that makes them buy or say yes? There’s not a whole lot that marketing can do for you, other than provide you with pretty brand colors, maybe a font, and a logo. You can craft everything you want in marketing. But if you don’t have the understanding that that marketing is going to get you the right leads. You’re losing money.

Jennifer: Right, exactly. You’re spending money without the ROI. And that’s-…

Katie: Because it’s not marketing’s job to get you ROI. Right. So let’s be super clear. From a business perspective, sales and marketing are two separate functions of your business that 100% have to be symbiotic, especially if you’re a small business. The bigger you get, the further apart they can get. I don’t recommend it, but it’s done all over the US, and I’m sure beyond. Sales and marketing teams have not gotten along forever, for no reason, other than the fact that there’s lots and lots of middle management involved, which is an amazing benefit that we have as smaller businesses, we can allow that to not happen.

Jennifer: Right.

Katie: So, marketing will always be a cost to your business. Its job is to put potential into your business, but it’s the sales function that pulls that potential all the way through to the cash piece. And so, in the beginning, what you need is your offer, and you need to be willing to talk about it to anybody you think it would benefit, so that you can literally just start listening to how they talk, what they have to say to you. the feedback that they provide you. and you can hone from there. When you’re a little bit more established, say your $250,000 business, your sales will look different, you now have proof of concept of whatever it is from a service perspective, or even maybe a product perspective, that it’s going to sell that you have a target market. And so the sales skills that you need after that are up-leveled, right, but all still based on some foundational pieces. So if you are a business owner who has an expertise, which we all do, let’s be clear-

Jennifer: I hope! If you don’t…

Katie: Right, if you don’t, maybe…

Jennifer: That’s a different conversation!

Katie: Yes, agreed, different podcasts altogether. So, you have your expertise, but you’ve never sold anything? My recommendation is before you do a thing, go enroll yourself in Sandler Training, or there’s multiple places where you can get a baseline of sales skill set to invest in you, so you can make money faster before you get to the burnout and crazy of running your own business.

Jennifer: I love that. And I think  that’s one of the things when people come to me for marketing. That’s my first question. Do you have a product? Have you successfully sold it? Because you’re right, I can bring you all the leads that are available, but if you can’t sell them…

Katie: Then that’s a super waste of your time. (laughs)

Jennifer: And money!

Katie: Well, it’s not a waste of your money, right? There’s nothing wrong with you sitting there collecting a check for someone who’s never going to collect on the ROI. I just happen to know you, and that’s not our bag, right?

Jennifer: No… it would make me very sad.

Katie: Right! I’m not here to just make money off of someone I want to be an impact to their bottom line, their top line, all their lines.

Jennifer: Exactly!

Katie: You know, I want them to be successful. So, yes, sales first, then talk to Jennifer.

Jennifer: What are some myths that you find in the sales field, like people come to you and they’re like “this,” and you’re like, “that is so not true.”

Katie: How many people have you seen say, “Well, I don’t want to be pushy when I sell.”

Jennifer: (laughs) Oh, yeah…

Katie: The word “salesy” in and of itself, like doesn’t even exist in the world other than in our own minds. And like, it’s a vibe of some kind that we’re all supposed to get, right. (both laugh) And so, the biggest myths are that if you are actively talking about what you’re doing, that you’re pushing your “something” onto somebody else. And the reason why that’s a myth is because if you don’t, if you’re not the person who says “I am it for you,” there is the potential for us to have an amazing working relationship, you’re actually harming the community that you purport to want to be serving.

Jennifer: Right.

Katie: It’s not their job to know you. So, you know, I think social media, while we all need to be there for proof that we exist-

Jennifer: Absolutely.

Katie: Right, this is why we have to have a website, so people can go say, “oh, Katie Sales UpRising, it’s a real thing. She’s real, she’s not a bot,” or whatever else I could be. It allows us to think that our market is constantly learning about us and what we can provide, and so we never have to talk about it. And the truth is, that’s a bunch of BS. I’m living my whole life, (laughs) paying attention to a whole bunch of other things that are not you and you could be the best thing for me. So I personally would really appreciate it if you’d let me know that you think you can help me. And so the fact that sales is icky, or sales is gross, or sales is pushy, or you know, or it makes you wrinkle your nose, I recommend you step back from being the CEO of your business, because it’s something that you’re absolutely going to have to do and if you can’t get over the mindset that it’s gross or bad, it’s not going to be successful for you, it will show through in your conversations that you feel that way and leave your potential customers super confused.

Jennifer: Yeah, I love that because there’s this, I think there’s this myth out there with attraction, like attraction marketing or attraction, you know, attracting your energy or whatever that kind of stuff, and while that’s all well and good, attracting people to your Facebook page, or to your podcast, or to whatever, and not having an offer at the end… you’re doing nothing.

Katie: You’re leaving them hanging!

Jennifer: You are! You are.

Katie: So let’s talk about law of attraction. Where I find laws of attraction work best for us, is in our own personal lives, right. Like so, as long as I am 100% me, I will be the brightest, shiniest lighthouse for the vibrational energies that are like me, that may need my stuff. They may not, they may not even be business owners, but they might be. Right, I’m gonna have to go find out, gonna have to do a little legwork on that. I am sure with the right marketing team, laws of attraction can work for your marketing, where people are just hopping into your list and opting into all of your things. With that being said, if what your Opt-in is, or your offer is, is not in alignment with who you are, and what you’re attracting, it’s not going to do a whole lot of good!

Jennifer: Yeah!

Katie: Right, you and I’ve had conversations about how we show up, right? Is how I show up 100% in alignment with everything that I do and everything that I offer?

Jennifer: Right.

Katie: It’s that simple.

Jennifer: Right.

Katie: If the answer is no, you’re communicating that everything communicates. So even if you don’t think that people will notice, people will notice. We’re amazing BS detectors when we pay attention.

Jennifer: Yeah. And the opposite side of that really is there’s- I heard a couple of months ago about women need, this was something that hit me, they need to be invited. Especially so if your target audience is women, most people want to be invited, right? Which is kind of the whole point of a sales offer, right? You’re inviting them to work with you. But especially if your audience is women, they need that invitation to- they’re not going to ask you. Okay, so there may be one or two that do let’s say do, and-

Katie: And if you’re saying “I only want to work with the people who are gonna throw their credit card in my pocket,” great, then you need to be out there even more.

Jennifer: Right, right.

Katie: And, you better have a “something” that delivers on exactly what they think it is. Because the minute you take their cash without any kind of qualifying or sales conversation, that’s where it can potentially go wrong.

Jennifer: Exactly.

Katie: Right? People have thrown money at me before, in appropriate ways, Jennifer Tamborski. (J: laughs) We’re talking about for a business, at a Starbucks having a coffee one on one where they slide their credit card cost across and say “I just already know I want to work with you,” this is what I’m talking about. And I will slide it back and say “I’m so excited at the potential of that. But let’s have a conversation first.”

Jennifer: Right. “What are your expectations?”

Katie: “What do you think you think I can do for you?”

Jennifer: Right.

Katie: At the minimum, I need to know that. I can’t assume.

Jennifer: That’s very true, because when someone comes to you like that, they may not understand exactly what you do. They just love who you are, which is fabulous and amazing! And, if you take their money and can’t provide them what it is that at least a semblance of what it is they think they’re buying, that’s gonna be a problem.

Katie: It will show up in my testimonials, I am sure.

Jennifer: Absolutely.

Katie: It will show up on my Google rating or whatever, you know, whatever it is my marketing people take care of for me. But that’s kind of the thing, right? I say things like “Sales is my love language.” I stood up in front of a room five years ago and literally was a sponsor of a women’s business day, and got my three minutes up front to say who I was, and you know, ask them if they wanted to talk to me further, I’d be in the back of the room over the course of the breaks or whatever. And they had a lovely woman who literally ran across the room with her credit card at me! And I was like, “Did I say I was selling something today? Like what is going on?” And she said, “Katie, Katie, Katie, I know that we need to work together. Here’s my credit card. What- how do I work with you?” And I said, “Well, this is lovely. Thank you. Keep your money for a minute.” “Why?” (both laugh) I literally was up there for three minutes. I let you know that sales is where it’s at, so why do you think you need- what do you think you’re getting? (J: Right). And she’s like, well, here’s the thing, you obviously love selling and I need to love selling too. And I was like, “Okay, we’ll get a one to one together, right that I might be able to help you. If you’re looking to love sales, I might be able to help you.” Who knew what she had heard?

Jennifer: Right. And that’s very true, because what we say and when people hear… not always the same thing.

Katie: No, a whole rainbow of beautiful perceptions are in the middle of what I say and what other people hear.

Jennifer: Absolutely. Okay so, during your talk, at the retreat we were at, you gave three things that everybody needs to do in a sales call.

Katie: Yes…

Jennifer: Not only those three things, however, they are important pieces of sales calls. So I would love for you to share those three things.

Katie: Wonderful. Let’s hope I can remember that- no, I’m joking. So I think, first and foremost, we talked about keeping it simple. When we don’t know about selling, and should we have any fear or missed mismanaged mindset about what a sales process looks like, we tend to make it super complicated because our- you know, it’s in our DNA to keep us safe. So if sales is scary, stay away from it, make it super complicated, all these things. So first and foremost, and while this is not one of the things, I’m going to tell you, everybody who’s listening, just keep it simple. It doesn’t have to be complicated, it doesn’t have to be the biggest most arduous process ever, it can actually all happen in a blink of an eye, the more you practice. So it’s Jennifer’s job, to make sure you have juicy, amazing prospects, if you’ve gotten to a place where you can communicate appropriately, about who you are, the problems you solve, and the people that you solve them for. So if you’ve gotten to that level, you’ve got juicy prospects and the top of your pipeline, your first thing is you have to qualify them. Even if Jennifer has created amazing quizzes for you. If she has given you fantastic drip campaigns that people have been following, even if there’s a form that people fill out to say, “This is me, I’m jumping into you, let’s do some work together,” you still have to qualify. Because, how many of you, and Jennifer I know it’s happened you, but how many of you have literally gotten off a call, it’s been amazing, you meet this great connection, you know that the two of you are destined for each other. And this could be in dating or sales, like it really didn’t matter, like just in life. And then you hang up the phone. And a life happens. And I just mean, not a whole life. But maybe somebody was born, maybe somebody died, maybe the roof caved in, maybe there was a horrible storm, maybe the best thing on earth, you won the lottery like life, a whole life happened as soon as you hung up the phone. And so being on the other end of that phone, when I call you back, it’s my job to assume that a whole life happened and re-qualify you back into the love story that we have for each other. (J: Right) The types of questions that you’re going to ask, even if- even if Jennifer has gone so far as to, on the form, ask what your potential clients budget is, you’re still going to need to ask the question. (J: Yeah) And it can sound like “So hey, in your opt-in form for this call, it looks like you had scheduled $10,000 for your budget for our work together. Is that right?”

Jennifer” Simple, right? It’s just a simple question.

Katie: They’re all just simple questions. One, hello, who’s ever accidentally added to zero? Like, what if it’s really only $1,000? There’s a world of difference between a thousand and ten thousand dollars when it comes to work. So, instead of holding someone accountable for what they put on a static form, do them the favor of getting to know them understanding how they got to those answers, what they were thinking when they wrote them. There are 100 questions in a qualifying conversation that can also just be called getting to know someone, right? It doesn’t have to- it doesn’t have to sound like I’m qualifying a deal, although that’s 100% what you’re doing.

Jennifer: Yes, yes.

Katie: Right?

Jennifer: Absolutely.

Katie: The great news is, that if you are qualifying them, and you’re listening, you’re authentically curious about who they are, you’re listening more than you’re talking, you’re able to paraphrase and mirror back to them your understanding of their scenario, right? By the time it comes for you to present, which is the second piece of your sales process, that’s super important, you already have all the answers. When you go through your qualifying questions, or you’re getting to know you or your relationship building portion of your sales funnel, and you have then decided, yes, they are a fit, they understand what I can deliver, I can deliver that for them. So this doesn’t involve them. This involves you as the business owner, you have to make some serious decisions. And, ladies and gentlemen, the first year you have in business is not going to be the same as the second year or the third year. So your client is going to morph and change and get honed and sharpened. So if you’re newer in business, what you will accept as a client will look different as you really hone in on your own expertise because you’re doing the thing!

Jennifer: Right, exactly.

Katie: So, because you’ve gotten to know them and they’re yes for you and you’re a yes for them, then you get to present to them, the beautiful part about it is that- you already know what they’re looking for. So you can literally take your information and present it to them in a way that they can hear it clearly. And authentically, you’re like, “Oh, I get you, here’s my, my expertise. You said you needed this, this is how we do this. This is what it’s going to feel like for you. This is where you’ll be at the end of the time that we work together.” And then you have to do the last thing.

Jennifer: Which I think is the hardest thing for people sometimes…

Katie: It is, and I’m going to hopefully give them a tip that lets them know that it shouldn’t be the hardest thing. That’s “ask for the business.” Some people call it closing, that’s like a typical sales term for that, like “close the business.” Some people will then use the hack of saying, “so just convert them to the next phase of doing business with you, which is the delivery piece,” right? I don’t care how you look at it, make it as easy on yourself as possible. But what it comes down to is you have to ask! You cannot assume that after you get to know them. And after you present your…
solution, that they’re going to say, “yes.” Now there is a type of selling where you let them close. Which I think everybody really wants. Everybody wants their clients to close themselves.

Jennifer: Yes, absolutely.

Katie: Here’s the trick, you better be able to stay super quiet.

Jennifer: That’s the worst. I’m really not a quiet person. I’m going to be honest, like that’s, that’s my- shutting my mouth? Biggest problem I have.

Katie: If one is nervous about the concept of selling, at all, being quiet is not an easy thing. Because our nerves get the better of us. And so we just want to like talk over spaces. And we want to, you know, we don’t want to give you too much time to think about it in our own head, even though we really want you to have time to think about it. But our brain is saying, “no, no, hurry, hurry, hurry, hurry, get them to say yes, get them to say yes.” So there is the potential to let them close and that’s where after you’re presenting, you ask the question, “did you have any other questions? Can you see how we would be a great fit to work together?”

Jennifer: I love that question.

Katie: And you just hold still.

Jennifer: For those of you that watch this on YouTube, you’ll notice I hardly ever hold still. So again, hard process for me.

Katie: So, if holding still is not an activity that you have mastered as yet, then just feel comfortable asking for the business and it can look exactly the same way. “Did you have any other questions about how I can serve you? Or can you see how we’re a great fit together?” Let them answer their yes or no question, which again, is something that’s taught where we shouldn’t do don’t ask a closed ended question. I think that’s super silly. Because there’s ways to get more information out of closed ended question also.

Jennifer: Right! Yeah, I mean, if they say no, the next question is “Okay, what more information do you need?” Or, you know-

Katie: Get it, Tamborski!

Jennifer: What else is in there that, you know, how else can I help you, kind of thing? There’s another question, you can ask that Yes/No question.

Katie: Yep! So it’s okay. Like, it’s all right. When you’re thinking about the conversations you have with friends, or colleagues, or the people at the grocery store, like every conversation involves closed ended questions. And we always have follow up. Oh, can you tell me why? Can I ask why? What’s going on? I thought we were going down a certain way. I obviously misunderstood. Where did I go wrong?

Jennifer: Yeah… And think about the amount of information you learn by those questions, right Because then your next sales call becomes easier!

Katie: If you’re paying attention to the data you’re collecting.

Jennifer: If you’re paying attention, yes.

Katie: So ask for the business, qualify, present, and ask. Now here’s the thing that I promised, I would tell you guys that may make it easier for you to ask for the business. The sale doesn’t happen at the asking. It’s not it doesn’t happen all the way at the end. That’s not where it happens. And if you start paying attention to when you personally when you go to buy your next thing, whether it’s a service or a product, and you’re talking to the person, if you start thinking about where you create the buy-in to say yes to this person, you will see it’s not when they say, “are you ready to do business together?”

Jennifer: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Katie: So where is it Jennifer, where does the sale happen?

Jennifer: I mean, it’s generally even before you present it, honestly, it’s building that rapport with them. That’s what’s going to end up making your sales process easier.

Katie: She listened! That’s the thing, right? So it happens in the qualification portion. Think about how much intellect and expertise you can communicate by asking appropriate questions for what your customer needs.

Jennifer: Right. Right.

Katie: And that’s what is going to make people go, “Oh my gosh, this person is super smart and totally knows what I need. Huh, I should feel comfortable telling them exactly what that looks like.” So as you go through your qualification, or your “getting to know you section” like, however you’re going to call it to make it easier for you gonna do it. Remember that it’s still about you presenting, like physically and verbally and non verbally presenting who you are the expertise you have, and how what you have will serve them. That’s where the deal happens. So by that logic, people could say, “Well, so Katie, why do I really need to ask?”

Jennifer: Because people like to be asked.

Katie: People do like to be asked, back to your point about how women like to be invited. And that’s not their job. (J: Right) So any two way communication where someone is actively selling, I have things that you need, it is my job to say, how would you like to work together? Because they’re not the expert, they can think that they really like you. But until you ask them, they’re going to wonder if you think that they’re right for you. (J: Right) They’re gonna wonder, can this person help me? And I can’t communicate that to them unless I ask them to do business with me. So basically, if you go through the whole conversation, and it’s looking really good, and you don’t ask, you are now like
a tease. You are now like- you’re rude. And I know that I know, that sounds like kind of harsh. But you’re literally leaving the person that you want to serve hanging about whether or not- now they’re starting to feel like, “Oh, my gosh, I got it wrong.”

Jennifer: Yeah. Either you’re not the person that can help me, or maybe I’m not ready for that service, or like, there’s all that internal dialogue that we never hear someone else having. starts happening.

Katie: Yep! And none of it looks good for you. And it certainly doesn’t put them in a place where they want to buy from you. And the next time you follow up with them, because you’re thinking “This conversation went great. Why haven’t they hit my ‘Buy Now’ button?” When you go to call them again, it is exponentially more difficult to recreate rapport than it is to create rapport the first time! (J: Right) So you’re only setting yourself back if you can’t be brave enough to ask.

Jennifer: I love that. I love those three tips. Because I think one of the biggest ones that people miss in any of their sales training that they have or not have, is the first. Right? Actually asking those qualification questions. Because it is important to know whether or not they can afford your services, right, like step one, how much time do you need to invest in these people? Because they have $2 to spend like, is that going to be good for you or not?

Katie: Or conversely, they have a $50,000 budget. Can your business handle the amount of work that they need?

Jennifer: Exactly! That’s a very good point.

Katie: You know, where are you? Could you deliver on that? They buy into you so much they want to give you all the money? Can you say yes to that? Is that what you’re looking to do in your business?

Jennifer: Yeah, is your business ready to sustain that kind of thing, or is it even your desire? (K: Right!) I remember, you know, when I first started building my business, I focus on the solopreneur in my business, right? Like the small businesses and I had someone asked me, he’s like, “Well, what if a business comes to you, and they have $100,000 to run their marketing?” And I’m like, “They’re not my client, like enterprise and above clients. They’re not my ideal client.”

Katie: I’m happy to refer them out. I’ve got the right people for that, it’s amazing.

Jennifer: Exactly! I have some amazing people  that I can refer them to. That’s not what I do. And that’s not where my business sits. Could it someday? Sure. Right now, that’s not what I want. So that is a huge point to I think the audience have of just understanding that.

Katie: You know, the reason why I am a business coach that talks about a revenue mindset burst or a sales mindset burst and how cash flow is oxygen and sales is freedom, and all of these things is because at the end of the day, if you want a successful business, your business has to do two things and that’s actually pay you as the business owner and pay for itself. And we never really think about that a whole lot, we are always happy to somehow in the beginning of our business, go ahead and make sure that our business stays alive. And somehow, as long as the business is alive, I personally am okay with that, but that’s not true now is it is, you know, the business doesn’t pay my mortgage, unless I cut myself a check out of this, oh, there’s some, there’s some business things that I need to take care of, and money in my business that allows all my business expenses to be paid, as well as for my life to be paid, lets me know that I’m, at the very least, on the first rung of success of business. And that will never happen unless we get super comfortable with selling. I wish everybody to be comfortable selling.The CEO, especially when you’re small, Jennifer, the CEO needs to be the number one salesperson in their business. The majority of businesses that you and I work with do not have venture capital, they don’t have a huge startup bank account for themselves where they could go buy a sales team. And, here’s my second, unasked-for tip. Even if you have the money to go out and buy the best salesperson ever, let me tell you something, it’s not gonna go well for you. I know it’s not what you want to hear, dear people, I adore you. So I’m literally giving this to you. So you don’t trip into this pit of despair. Remember, Princess Bride? Here’s the deal. I’ve been in sales my whole life. You want to hire me as a salesperson? Well, first of all, so the reason why I am not a outsourced salesperson is because I’m no longer interested in giving a man a fish, I now want to teach my people how to fish so they can continue to feed themselves when I am not here. Okay, so that’s why I am no longer available for selling. But here’s the thing, even if you could afford me, as an outsourced salesperson, there are going to be some pretty specific questions that I asked because you’re going to ask me to be commission only. You’re not going to ask me to be on salary. You’re a small business, and I’m a hot stuff salesperson. So you’re gonna say “Alright, Katie, so you know how to sell stuff, so I’ll give you 60% commission. Just to give me clients.” Fantastic. Who’s your client? What’s the sales lifecycle to close them? How much are your services? What are the top 10 frequently asked questions about your services? What are your top 10 most frequent objections? And please note, I said, top 10 Because I know some of you are going to say I only have two; time and money. And I’m going to tell you all that I hear when you say that, is that you don’t sell enough.

Jennifer: Yes.

Katie: If you tell me, “Well, Katie, my conversion rate is 90%.” I’m going to ask you how many clients you’ve actually tried to bring into your services in the past months, because a 90% conversion rate on a word of mouth business, where you only talk to four people in a month still isn’t enough data to inform me, as a hot stuff salesperson, that I can make a living serving as an outsourced salesperson for you. You have to be the number one salesperson in your business, even if it’s not what you want to do forever, so that you can afford to grow your team.

Jennifer: Yeah, there does come a point in business when you can hire a hot stuff salesperson, right?

Katie: If you’ve made enough money! Look sales cures all ill, man.

Jennifer: Exactly, exactly. And it becomes- you really have to know all of the data, right? You have to be able to inform your salesperson of everything they need to know about your business in order to sell it.

Katie: Because if you are coming to me and saying, “Well, Katie, you’re the one who would know. Because you sell for a living.” I’m going to look at you like you’re out of your mind.

Jennifer: Because just because you sell for a living, doesn’t mean you sell for them for a living… Yeah.

Katie: I don’t know you! If you say “Well, I’m a business coach, and I see that you’ve sold for business coaches,” I still don’t know you. You want me to go sell you like I sold my last person? Like what is your- what’s your bag? Why are you special? What’s your value differentiator, every business owner hates this question. What’s your value differentiator, right, what makes you different? But the answer is still there. And if you say “well, I’m different because I’m me,” that’s not helpful to me as a business development or salesperson. I can’t sell that. Well, Jennifer is Jennifer. And so and you got to have some Jennifer. And I have a lot of vocabulary to pull from when I’m talking to people. But that’s really what it leaves me with. So just like with your marketing team and being able to describe your ideal client, not your customer avatar, not that, but actually who buys from you and why they buy from you. And you know this because you ask, right? So just like that, a sales team is going to ask you the same exact questions.

Jennifer: And if they don’t, don’t hire them.

Katie: Thank you, Jennifer. I’m with her. So there you go. How’s that for juicy?

Jennifer: I loved this, like I love all of this. And honestly, sales is such a topic that we can go on for hours and hours about it. So I think, for those of you my audience that are struggling with sales, or are uncomfortable with sales, or just want to learn to love sales, how do they get a hold of you, Katie?

Katie: Well, from my understanding, there’s flyers all over the US, no I’m joking. It’s such a strange question. One, I will provide you with a QR code. So anybody can do all of that fun stuff. I’m sure it’ll be posted below. But you can find me at SalesUpRising everything. So my Instagram handle is @SalesUpRising. Have a YouTube channel, I don’t do interviews like you do, but I have a couple of seasons of some really fun sales tips that are easily edible, edible, right, like easy bait and absorb. Katie at SalesUpRising.com. I’m also on Facebook @SalesUpRising, I’m on LinkedIn @SalesUpRising. And if you think it would be beneficial, my dear, there’s a kind of like a white paper called “The Seven Stumbling Blocks to Six Figures.”

Jennifer: Oh, I love that.

Katie: And it really has to do with like what keeps us stuck in a non-selling space. And if we stay there too long, then we’re not giving our business, the oxygen it needs, which is cashflow to be successful. And so literally our dream is killing us, which is not where we want any of our people to be. So I’m happy to go ahead and make sure you guys have “The Seven Stumbling Blocks to Six Figures,” so that maybe you can pull yourself out of that pit of despair and start making you some money.

Jennifer: Awesome, awesome. So all of that information will be in the show notes. So you don’t have to chase it down. And I would encourage you if you’re struggling right now to reach out to Katie, because sales is the key to a business, in general. Thank you all for joining us. And thank you, Katie, for being here. I love this conversation.

Katie: My absolute pleasure. I so appreciate the opportunity to serve your humans. They’re my humans too. And I hope you guys, look, do me a favor and just let me know what like what stuck with you? What’s your one takeaway? What are you going to work on? What did you hear that, even though you’ve heard it before, it’s really going to stick this time and it’s the thing that you’re going to do to pay yourself like what, what out of Jennifer nice conversation really is sticking with you and you’re going to be accountable for? I would love to know.

Jennifer: That is a great question. And I would also love to know that because I always want to make sure that these shows and episodes are beneficial to you, my audience. Thank you for joining me at Marketing Matchmaker and I will talk to you next week!

Outro: Thank you for listening to the marketing matchmaker podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, I would love to hear your feedback. Please head over to Apple iTunes and leave a review so we can hear from you. And if you are a coach, consultant or online course creator who are looking to grow your business, increase your income and scale your impact. And that’s with me at your marketing matchmaker.com I look forward to hearing from you.